Video Interview:Marilyn Manson Dinner for Five
- From the Independent Film Channel, Dinner For Five with Marilyn Manson,Andy Dick, Daryl Hannah (Bladerunner), and Jon Favreau. Amongst the humour of Manson & Dick, Manson speaks on topics such as Luis Buñuel, a surrealist film director, who directed the film Ensayo de un crimen (The Criminal Life of Archibaldo de la Cruz) (1955), Pay-Per-View pornography, details on Manson's film Groupie, his autobiography, lucid dreaming, creative writing, absinthe, and much more. Taped on January 13, 2002, aired on May 6, 2002 
Dinner for Five with Marilyn Manson
DINNER FOR FIVE
(The show begins with everyone talking about who to call as the fourth guest was unable to attend, and they show a graphic of a black screen with white text to inform the television audience of this)
Andy: Well, I'll start calling at that point, dude. At that point, I'll start calling.
Daryl: We're at that point, so you should start calling (laughs).
[GRAPHIC]: At the last minute, one of our guests was unable to attend.
Andy: But we're not filming right now.
Jon: Yes, we are.
Manson: Can you do, it's like in high school and you're out and you're like, "Hey, do you got a cute friend for one of us?" Can you do that type of thing?
Jon: Well, Daryl's calling Tim Curry. Who do you wanna call?
Andy: Tim Curry?!
Daryl: Can I borrow one of your phones?
Andy: Yours real quick... [unintelligible] --- (Andy possibly asking Manson for his phone number)
Manson: There's a little theme developing then with the Tim Curry dresses up in the women's clothes...
Andy: Tim Curry? You gotta call Tim Curry.
Manson: ... and Marilyn Manson and Andy Dick. It's a little un-heavy on the girl side.
Andy: I'm calling Tony Kaye.
Jon: You're gonna call Tony Kaye?
Andy: Do you know him? ...
Manson: Is he straight?
Jon: No, let's call Tim Curry.
Daryl: But I have no phone.
Andy: ... Director of American History X.
Manson: (to Andy) Name-dropper.
Jon: (looking through someone's cell phone) Tommy - Tommy Lee? Is this your celebrity page?
Manson: Do you think he'll get his dick out? --- (in reference to Tommy Lee)
Andy: Call Tommy Lee. Call Tommy Lee.
Daryl: No, he lives really far away.
Andy: No, in Malibu... call him anyway. I wanna talk to him. I wanna talk to him. I have to...
Manson: You wanna see his ding-ding?
Andy: Shut up!
Manson: I'm asking. You've seen it.
Andy: We've all seen it. Rick James!
Manson: RICK JAMES could get the party started!
Manson: I got Rick James' number too, but on my cell phone, like I need to call him real quick. It's an emergency. I better call Rick James. . .
Andy: No, no, no. You don't understand. No, no, no. We're friends, for reasons I don't want to get into. Don't make that call.
Manson: . . . I've got a hooker tied up. What do I do?
[GRAPHIC]: SPRINGTIME FOR HITLER
Jon: (to Daryl, about Andy) I love your show. And you know, there's this channel, a music channel: MTV...
Andy: Have you heard it? The music television.
Daryl: Yes. Jon: He has a - he has a show where...
Daryl: I actually heard that you ran around New York naked and you couldn't get arrested. That's what I heard.
Andy: I think that was - that might've been Tom Green. That doesn't sound like me.
Manson: And he mocks me on the show, on two separate episodes.
Jon: On the show? That's right, you dressed up like...
Jon: What was the character you played?
Andy: Him! I played him, as Marilyn Manson.
Manson: Me. Me as Mary Poppins.
Jon: You playing who?
Andy: Manson as...
Manson: (finishing Andy's sentence) ... as Mary Poppins.
Andy: 'Cause rockers are doing Broadway. Like that guy from, uh, Def Leppard. Or I don't remember, Motley Crue or something.
Manson: Yeah, they wanted me to do... I was gonna do The Producers - Springtime For Hitler.
Jon: They wanted you to be in that?
Andy: (laughing) They probably did!
Jon: As the director?
Manson: No, no, no, no. They were doing a 50-Years-of-Broadway celebration, but it was before the thing in New York happened...
Manson: ... so they kinda, I guess, postponed it.
Manson: But they said I could pick any number, and I wanted to do the Springtime For Hitler piece 'cause I thought it was kind of a more music thing...
Jon: Yeah, sure, sure.
Daryl: Before it was called The Producers, it was called Springtime For Hitler.
Jon: The whole movie?
Manson: It's a snappier title. But it doesn't go over well with everyone.
Daryl: My father was a real estate man, but he was sent it to produce. And it was called Springtime For Hitler. And he was a Russian Jew, so he just threw it away immediately, and then it ended up being his favorite movie.
Jon: That's so funny.
[GRAPHIC]: CURSE OF THE JADE SCORPION
Andy: I do find it hard to read. I went to, um, I saw Curse of The Jade Scorpion. No, I do. The subtitles.
Manson: I like all those weird...
Andy: In Barcelona, right?
Andy: And it was subtitled in Spanish. And I got to watch it.
Jon: And everybody else is...
Andy: And I watched all the other people, but they know English so well. I mean...
Jon: Do they?
Andy: The Spaniards. Are you Spanish?
Jon: No, I'm not. Everybody, basically everybody other than - every European knows English better than we know their language.
Andy: They do. Well, yeah. It's very true. And they loved it! First of all, it was Sunday night, 10 o'clock at night, like now. Like Sunday at 10, at night, and it was packed. I had to sit in the last row. But the movie, they loved it. They loved it. They laughed at every line. They love Woody Allen, and then I heard that he was just there.
Jon: They like him more there than they like him here, I think.
Andy: Oh yeah, they were - they ate every line up. They laughed, "Ho, ho, ho, ho, I'm a Spaniard!" I mean, literally, it was like...
Andy: They step over.
Manson: I liked the uh, Sweet and Lowdown.
Jon: I liked that one too.
Andy: I liked that one too, a lot.
Jon: Although I guess they didn't get along too well on that one, right?
Andy: Sean Penn?
Jon: Yeah, they didn't get along very well.
Andy: He didn't tell me that.
Jon: I don't know.
Andy: I ran into him, but I never - I met him one time, Sean Penn.
Jon: I've met him, but the last thing I would do is like, talk shop with him.
Andy: I did.
Jon: 'Cause you get the sense he doesn't like talking shop, even when he's supposed to.
Andy: I did. I hung out with him for hours though, at The Standard. And he was, you know, having a few cocktails and he didn't mind talking shop. I just wanted to know - (laughs) - just 'cause it's me. I'm like, "Did you do drugs during this movie? Were you high during this one?" That's what I wanted to know. I mean, "Nicholson, is he really like, coked up all the time?"
Jon: It all relates to drugs for you?
Manson: Buñuel did this movie called The Criminal Life of Archibaldo de la Cruz. And it's about this little boy that gets this gift from his mother. And she tells him that if he plays it, it's a music box - it can make someone die. And then she dies right after she gives it to him. And so he grows up, and it's real perverse 'cause he has like, this foot fetish. And the director has - they just put out a book about Bunuel and it's about how he has these fetishes in all of his movies.
Jon: Uh huh.
Andy: I think the director Todd Phillips has a foot fetish. I'm serious, I'm not making that up.
Manson: Very, very, creepy, strange Spanish director. He's my favorite: Buñuel. I just really got to appreciate the nuances of older films. A different style of acting, a different style of directing, and storytelling. But especially Spanish movies...
Jon: You're into that?
Manson: ... they have a serious, different sense of humor that I really like.
Daryl: Great sense of humor.
Manson: I really like.
Jon: Why? What's different about it?
Daryl: But don't you think, too, that when you read subtitles, sometimes you can - you can project a little bit about how the performances are? (laughs)
Jon: I think very much so.
Manson: Yeah, I always wondered about that. It's hard to decide if the person's a good actor or not 'cause you're not - unless you understand the native tongue.
Daryl: Because I remember one time seeing something that was dubbed. And I mean, it was just the most unwatchable film that I've ever seen.
Daryl: And partly because it was dubbed. But also, then you're much more aware of the acting because you're watching their faces rather than subtitles...
Jon: Right, right, right.
Daryl: ... and then referring back up.
Daryl: But I hears just recently that, for example, that Blockbuster is having real trouble, and the independent world is changing a lot.
Andy: Blockbuster's having trouble? What? What? What?
Daryl: They were having big troubles until Shrek.
Jon: Why, 'cause they made so much money?
Daryl: Yeah, Shrek rented a lot, but otherwise it's going out of business because of all the, you know, satellite channels...
Jon: Oh, right, right.
Daryl: ... and DVD, and...
Manson: I gotta tell you my biggest complaint with Direct TV, and this happened to me again last night. What happens is, and I'm an idiot because I have a DVD player. And I've got the porno DVDs, you know, stashed. Fortunately, I keep - I don't keep 'em in the bedroom. And if I'm a little drunk, I'm a little lazy, I just go for the Direct TV. $10.99.
Manson: Problem is, you switch it on, it's like four in the morning, and it's in between. There's some bullshit conversation going on, there's no penetration. So you go and you switch it and you order another one. And then you got like, a weird, like, sports-oriented, like - a bunch of real husky guys.
Manson: So, I'm flicking between them, I'm toggling, just trying to get some, one second of penetration.
Andy: What are you looking for? Just a little mix? Or just straight - just straightforward? Or a little mix-y?
Manson: Just a girl spreading her legs at any point's gonna work for me. (to Daryl) I'm not offending you, am I?
Daryl: No, it's okay.
Andy: (laughing) They're not gonna use any of this.
Manson: So, I ended up spending $25 last night.
Jon: 'Cause each time you toggle, it goes to another...
Manson: It goes to another cost.
Jon: If it's $10.99 each, why is it $25?
Manson: You know what the worst thing is? Half the time, if I'm real determined, I don't even get to the opening credits, and I'm done. You should be able to get a refund back. I do that at hotels though, 'cause at hotels, they give you five minutes, and I'm just like a - I'm just like a lightning bolt.
Jon: You just sample it? You say, "I didn't really want that one."
Manson: Yeah. Sometimes just reading the titles will work. And you're really, really desperate.
Jon: Speaking of which, I was just in Vegas yesterday for the porn Oscars.
Andy: Oh, what are those called again?
Jon: The AVN Awards.
Andy: Did you present?
Daryl: Were you presenting?
Andy: (laughing) Then why were you there?!
Jon: I'm writing a movie - I'm rewriting a movie called Porn Star. A romantic comedy about...
Andy: Oh yeah. I know about that. Oh yeah.
Jon: So, one of the scenes takes place at these awards, and the person who's consulting on the film...
Andy: Is Ron Jeremy.
Jon: (laughs) ... is from one of the video companies. So, I was there for the whole porn awards. But the best thing is that they announce all the titles. And they have different categories.
Andy: (laughing) I love the titles to porn movies.
Jon: But they have like, Best Fetish Film. And one of the movies, I think the funniest one, it was called Toe Story.
Manson: Oh, I get it. It's subtle, but it's nice.
Jon: It's like Toy Story, but it's...
Manson: You don't have to explain it. I got it.
Jon: To you, I don't.
Manson: To me, I know. I liked Edward Penishands.
Andy: One of my favorite ones ever, is Hill Street Blacks.
Manson: It's not really funny, but it's... odd.
Jon: It's a good play on words.
Andy: As if putting 'black' in the title makes it instantly --- (Andy's laughing too much to finish his sentence, then says something unintelligible)
Manson: It should've been like, Dick Street Blues or something.
Andy: (laughing) Oh, I know!
[GRAPHIC]: BLADE RUNNER
Manson: I used to, at one point, wear the Blade Runner-style makeup.
Daryl: Did you?
Jon: Her - Pris's makeup?
Manson: Yeah, yeah.
Manson: I wore that in The Beautiful People video, and that was my homage to her.
Daryl: When I screen-tested for that movie, there were like five different girls screen-testing for my part. And we all got, like several days to come up with our look. And everybody created a different, you know, thing. And most of the girls were sort of space-age with little lightning bolts and really cute, and mannequin-like, or you know, beautiful. And I made myself into Nosferatu, you know, like a freak...
Manson: Oh, that's cool. That makes it even cooler.
Daryl: ... with the punk hair, and the thing. And when I saw everybody at the lunch, I was convinced that I had made myself into a hideous cartoon that wouldn't get the part.
Jon: Little did you know.
Daryl: And I started crying. I was like, "Oh, no. I've totally fucked it up." You know? And I did gymnastics in my audition and rolled my eyes back, and all this stupid stuff that ended up in the movie.
Manson: Yeah, that had such an impact on me when I saw it.
Jon: I know, me too. And I was like at that age too where I was like, I totally - I had like, the hugest crush on you from that.
Daryl: On me?
Jon: On that. It shows where my head was at.
Manson: It was like a Direct TV type of thing.
Jon: They didn't have Direct TV. It's kinda - it is kinda.
Andy: That's why you're sitting next to her. That's why you're sitting next to her.
Jon: (to Daryl) Did you know that it was gonna be like this - how cool the movie was gonna be just when you were working on it?
Daryl: It was like, um, it was one of my first movies and I really thought that that's what - that's what I expected film-making to be like and what I thought it was gonna be like, but...
Jon: Right, right.
Daryl: ... from then on, it never really was again.
Jon: Why? Because they collaborated with you to such an extent?
Daryl: It was collaborative. It was, I mean, even the screen test...
Manson: It was so grand looking.
Daryl: ... we had smoke, we had sets, we had lights, we had incredible D.P. It was...
Jon: It was Ridley Scott, right? Right at the beginning of his career?
Daryl: Yeah, it was Ridley Scott who had, you know, been an incredible art director.
Daryl: So, I mean, the visuals were just amazing, even for the screen tests. And I'd always studied things about the golden years of film-making; the '30s and '40s, so I didn't really know that they'd been making, you know, Logan's Run and a bunch of like, you know, '70s and pre-'80s movies and stuff.
Jon: Well, I had read - you did an article for I don't know what magazine it was. I read it on a plane, about Dancing At The Blue Iguana. And you had said it was the first role you had done where you had collaborated to that extent since Blade Runner. And Blade Runner didn't seem like a collaborative type of effort. It seemed like a really...
Daryl: Well, Blue Iguana was completely improvised. There was no script. It wasn't even like a Mike Leigh film. You know who Mike Leigh is?
Andy: Mike Leigh? No, who is he?
Jon: Naked. Secrets & Lies, right?
Daryl: British filmmaker.
Andy: Naked, and what?
Jon: Secrets & Lies?
Daryl: Secrets & Lies, Naked...
Jon: They like, rehearse with a cast and they...
Daryl: They have a structure and they improvise.
Andy: Like John Cassavetes.
Daryl: Yeah. That's why I loved Dancing At The Blue Iguana because it wasn't - it was a film made by the British director Michael Radford, who did Il Postino.
Daryl: And he, it was, it had no structure though. It wasn't even like, you know, there was no idea other than it took place in a strip club. And then everything was improvised from there. Everything...
Andy: Wow, I love that.
Jon: Yeah, that's pretty cool.
Daryl: ... the characters, our storylines, everything. So it was really - it was fun. Whether it made it a good film or not is subjected.
[GRAPHIC]: PETTING ZOO
Daryl: (to Manson) Your music is hard to get for independent films though, because we tried to get some of it for Blue Iguana, and they were like, "Not a chance."
Manson: Yeah, I would much rather actually create music for a movie, than to take a song that - you know, because...
Daryl: If people knew that.
Manson: ... I'm such a fan of movies that I'd like marrying the two together rather than taking something...
Daryl: Yeah, that exists.
Manson: Obviously, you can take a song and it'll work with the sentiment you're trying to make in a movie.
Manson: (to Jon) I'm sure you've picked music for your movies.
Jon: Yeah. A lot of times, there's like - music is a great shorthand to get a point across. Especially if there's a song that makes you feel a certain way.
Jon: A lot of times, you'll cut it to that soundtrack...
Manson: Nostalgia, and things like that.
Jon: ... or just because the mood is so right on. I mean, we had a stripper scene in Made and you know, we picked - we used Monster Magnet. We ended up using that band because it had a very heavy - 'cause it is true what we're talking about. The strippers now, there's a different sound. It's not fun - they like the - it's either Hip-Hop or like heavy Rock.
Jon: Dark, slow Rock.
Manson: Dracula music.
Daryl: Heavy music.
Jon: (to Daryl) You were saying that you were doing research for Blue Iguana. (speaking to Manson and Andy Dick now) She did research. She had to - she went to Jumbo's. You know Jumbo's Clown Room?
Andy: Clown Room. I've been there.
Jon: Which is probably the roughest spot.
Andy: They've got - those strippers, they just don't care. I remember seeing a girl - I went there and there was a girl and she must've been in her 50's, maybe even 60, and she was naked. Everything was just hanging and she was just like (Andy stands up and gyrates), "When's my break?" She was doing (he continues gyrating). She was all - she was all over it.
Manson: I can tell you, hands down, the best place, which I would've told you if I would've known you were doing this thing, is a place in Portland, OR called the Acropolis Steakhouse.
Daryl: (laughing) Why?
Manson: It's called the Acropolis Steakhouse. You go there and they've got these weird little corrals, and they're wooden, and they have little - like how you put the money in for the peanuts, like at a petting zoo. But in the corrals, are girls. They don't have a DJ - they just have a boombox. And the girl puts her own CD in - she's doing her dance and her thing, and then the song stops, and she's totally naked. Everything's going on, you're eating a $5 steak. And it's not a topless bar, it's totally nude. So you've got, you know...
Jon: What's the petting zoo, coin-operated vending machine for?
Manson: That's what I wanted to know.
Andy: It's to eat.
Manson: I didn't know if it was for the customers or you're supposed to feed the girls...
Jon: (laughs) That's so awful.
Manson: ... instead of money.
Daryl: It's for tips.
Daryl: The thing is, a lot of the clubs, like even Jumbo's. I mean, they're just - they're just topless or bikini bars, and you know.
Manson: That doesn't make too much sense.
Jon: Which I like better, to be honest with you.
Manson: Oh, I like burlesque stuff.
Jon: I don't like it at all - I don't want it all nude.
Manson: I like burlesque.
Daryl: Burlesque is entertaining.
Jon: It doesn't get me any more excited. I like it actually - women seem to feel more comfortable, I think, when they're wearing something.
Manson: I don't get excited by strip bars because I never would buy into the fact of the whole...
Jon: They really like you?
Manson: ... the lie that you're trying to buy into.
Jon: That they like me?
Manson: I mean, but for me, man - if I'm on tour, I can go to a strip bar.
Daryl: They do - they do like rock stars. They would like you.
Manson: I mean, if I wasn't myself, it would be different. But I could go to a strip bar and I have taken home girls from strip bars. But normally, I wouldn't buy into the lie, you know? I wouldn't sit there and give a girl money.
Manson: I'll wait until at least you're engaged to them and then you're forced to give them money, than to just give them money without any sort of promise, or note, or anything.
Jon: That's kind of cynical.
Manson: It is a little bit cynical.
[GRAPHIC]: GO TIGERS!
Andy: (to Jon) You and I have improvised together and that's how - I love it. I love it. I improvise on my show. It's so fun.
Daryl: Oh, it's so much...
Andy: It's like Christopher Guest.
Jon: Yeah, he's...
Daryl: Yeah, I worked with him too. He's great.
Jon: Yeah? What did you work with Chris Guest on?
Daryl: You know what? He directed, um, Attack of The 50 ft. Woman that I did for cable.
Jon: Oh, right.
Daryl: But it wasn't an improv thing...
Daryl: ... but that was before he...
Andy: Oh, he directed that?
Andy: Oh, that's so cool.
Jon: But that's sort of like, probably in the period where he was figuring out that he shouldn't be doing movies this way. Andy: What his style is.
Jon: Everybody goes through that sort of transition period.
Jon: And fortunately - and a lot of them, their best work is in that transition, that when they finally go full-on to what they're into... it gets too esoteric. But I think with him...
Daryl: His full-on is...
Jon: ... his full-on is like really entertaining. (to Andy) You went to Second City.
Jon: You were in Second City in Chicago.
Andy: Well, I took classes there, then I joined the troupe out here, in L.A.
Andy: The touring company. You were in the touring company also.
Jon: I never made the touring company. I was a dishwasher, in Chicago, but you had left already. (to Daryl) He was in an improv group before I was there, and he had left. But he was like the big star that had left Improv Olympic to move on to big movies.
Andy: It's always that way. I'm always like the guy - and then all my friends surpass me. He's like a big filmmaker now. Look at Jack Black.
Jon: Jack Black's doing really well.
Andy: He's kicking ass. It's like everybody's kicking ass.
Jon: But he's not from - is he from Chicago too?
Andy: No, but I've been out here...
Daryl: (to Jon) You're from Chicago?
Jon: I moved to Chicago for like four years, to do improv.
Daryl: But you're not from there.
Jon: I'm from New York.
Daryl: From New York.
Daryl: (to Andy) Where are you from?
Andy: I guess Chicago.
Daryl: I'm from Chicago.
Jon: (to Manson) You're from Canton, right?
Manson: I'm from Canton, OH originally, yeah.
Jon: Go Bulldogs.
Andy: I really lived in the suburbs of Chicago - Joliet.
Manson: That was - see, I would've went to McKinley, but my parents sent me...
Jon: Did you see Go Tigers!, by the way?
Manson: I have it. I didn't watch it yet.
Jon: Oh, you gotta see this.
Manson: About the Massillon Tigers.
Jon: Yeah. There's this movie called Go Tigers! about this huge cult, sort of, high school football rivalry between Massillon, OH and Canton, OH where they have a Vegas line, and if it's as crazy as it is in the movie, that must've been some place to grow up.
Manson: And the weird part for me was that my parents sent me to private Christian school. They weren't religious, they just wanted me to get a better education. They didn't even have a team, so I was just like the kid that all the sports guys wanted to beat up. I had a different school bus that I got off. It wasn't the 'short bus', but it was different. So, I would get my ass kicked on a regular basis (laughs).
Andy: I read - I read his book before I met him. I was just fascinated by it.
Daryl: (to Manson) You wrote a book?
Andy: Yeah, an autobiography. You know, about himself. It's fascinating. You should read it.
Manson: Yeah, back in '97.
Andy: But then you told me you made some of that up.
Manson: No, I said I had to change names and places and I had to combine stuff so that I wouldn't get in trouble.
Daryl: So the guys didn't come back and kick your ass again.
Manson: I won't go into the details of this film...
Andy: I will.
Manson: ... but I made this movie that I had intentions of putting onto my home video, not thinking that it would offend my own...
Jon: So, what was the scenario? You gotta slow down for me.
Manson: It was like a party at my house.
Jon: It was a real party, and you were taping with a real camera?
Andy: Yes, a video camera.
Manson: I said, "A girl's gonna show up, and then something's probably gonna go wrong, and you guys just roll with it."
Andy: And she comes over...
Manson: But nobody knew.
Andy: "Ding dong" - They're doing crap and drugs and weird shit. You - Twiggy - no, wait. Oh, that's right... you sucked Twiggy's cock on the video. On the video, you sucked Twiggy's cock.
Manson: There was a dispute over...
Andy: But he put a rubber on it.
Manson: And it was flaccid. It was flaccid.
Andy: Which was even gross. And it was soft, so it was disgusting. It was one of the freak shows. It's totally not - you know, it's great TV. It's great film. It's a film. We have to release this.
Manson: It wasn't just horseplay. The movie did scare the shit out of you though.
Andy: It did scare the shit - 'cause then, "Ding dong!" They're having fun, sucking each other's cocks, and then "Ding dong!" - "Ding dong!", who's at the door? A fan. "I just know that you live here and I made this..."
Daryl: A hired fan.
Andy: "... piece of art for you. Will you take it?" And you're like, "Sure. Why don't you come in?" And he pulls this - she must've been 18, literally.
Manson: Less, more, I don't know. For the purpose of the...
Andy: Less?! It better not be less, or you're in trouble!
Manson: No, no, no. She was portraying a youngster in the film. No, it was...
Andy: Well, she looked 18. She looked hot...
Jon: So, you made your own porn video.
Andy: ... she had the black hair...
Manson: No, no, it wasn't a porn video. It was not a porno.
Jon: You were blowing your bass player, but it wasn't porn?
Andy: ... It'd be like if you took Daryl and cut her hair and made it all black and weird bangs, and you were all Gothic.
Manson: I wasn't blowing my bass player. You're making this sound like a pornographic film.
Andy: No, it wasn't.
Manson: It was not a pornographic film.
Andy: They were having fun - it was a party. It honestly looked like someone left the camera on.
Andy: 'Cause at times, it looked like you just set it there.
Jon: Sort of a Blair Witch feel.
Manson: It was before Blair Witch. I didn't see Blair Witch when I did it.
Andy: This girl shows up and he lures her in. And she's, you know, excited to be there. She's like, "I'm such a big fan. I'm really excited." And then slowly, but surely, over time, and very subtly, he starts to get her to do certain things. And those are things that you know, maybe we shouldn't really discuss. But it gets...
Manson: No, but it gets really scary and everyone in the room didn't know whether I was kidding or it was a joke or not.
Andy: Wait, wait, wait. Let me describe the first thing he tries to get her to do. He tries to get her to drink Pogo's urine.
Andy: He pees in the wine glass, and then she's like, "You do it!" And he drinks it. And then - and then she finally does do that. But then there's other things that you don't want to know.
Manson: I introduce a gun into the situation. And it becomes really scary...
Andy: It's disturbing.
Manson: ... and I showed it to him. And he...
Andy: It was disturbing. I was disturbed...
Manson: It wasn't a pornographic film. But that was MY independent film.
Andy: ... if you can imagine that. No, people start bleeding at some point, and there's not good things happening...
Manson: A fight breaks out...
Andy: That girl is tied up by the end, and crying.
Manson: Well, don't tell the end of the story.
Jon: (laughing) Don't ruin it.
Manson: That was my independent film for ya.
Andy: That, all my friends...
Daryl: Did you get it distributed?
Manson: No, because when I showed it to my manager, he said, "Please hide the masters. If anyone sees this, you'll go to jail, and your career will be over."
Daryl: What's it called?
Manson: It was called Groupie.
[GRAPHIC]: SHAKESPEARE IN LOVE
Manson: I'm gonna admit to a crime that I've done. I don't know if this is a felony or a misdemeanor.
Andy: I'll tell you. I'll know.
Manson: But when you guys were talking about Blockbuster.
Jon: (laughs to Daryl) He brings us back to your thing.
Manson: Now, uh, I got a copy of Black Inches. This is a year or so - probably statute of limitation's up. I took out some Black Inches. I took out a couple of the choice photos from Black Inches. You know, black gentleman posing like this and show their inches or, you know, what have you. 'Cause it's self-explanatory.
Andy: Why do you get that magazine?
Manson: Because I have a purpose! Let me explain. So, I went - and this is right at the time when Shakespeare in Love came out. I went into Blockbuster and took carefully-folded pictures from Black Inches and I inserted them...
Daryl: Oh my god, it's a blowtorch! (in reference to the woman lighting Andy's cigar)
Manson: ... into rental copies of Shakespeare in Love, so that people that would rent Shakespeare in Love would take it home and they'd get an extra little surprise.
Jon: Maybe that's why it won the Oscar.
Manson: Ever use the William S. Burroughs style of writing? See, I like to write fiction.
Andy: What's that? Do a bunch of drugs?
Daryl: No, you cut and paste...
Manson: Yeah, that's a good way of it too.
Daryl: ... You cut little pieces of magazines, and any words that sort of have any kind of impact to you. It's a great way of writing.
Manson: It's cutting and pasting words, and then you create from it. But what I actually do is slightly different than that. I don't take...
Jon: But what does he do though? He just grabs words...
Daryl: It's like a Ouija board. You take any kind of...
Manson: He would cut stuff out of newspapers. He would jumble it up and make sentences.
Daryl: Yeah, and then you sort of Ouija it around.
Manson: And then you would take that, and you kinda go off of it.
Jon: Oh, I see.
Daryl: It's amazing though how it always gets to exactly what's going on with you. But how do you do it differently?
Manson: I don't do it by cutting up newspapers. I just have different phrases. Throughout the day, I'll just write down a phrase, and it may not have any relevance until later.
Daryl: Do you mix - do you move around where the positions of those phrases?
Manson: Yeah, yeah.
Daryl: It works really well though, doesn't it?
Manson: Yeah, but if you get that mixed up with like, your laundry list and girls' phone numbers, you come up with a real confusing...
Jon: Subliminal messages in your writing.
Andy: The only technique that I've used...
Manson: I don't have a laundry list. I've never washed my clothes in my life.
Andy: Don't you want to hear my technique?
Manson: I just wanted to clarify that I don't have a laundry list. I don't know what that is. I just said it to try and be 'normal'.
Andy: The only technique I've ever used, I thought I made it up, but then I heard that it's actually somebody did it a long time ago, like Plato or somebody like that.
Andy: No, I - no, Ben Franklin, I think. I know there's a lot of years in between those two (laughs).
Jon: One of those guys.
Andy: But either way, it's when you're about - you're falling asleep. Right before you fall asleep.
Manson: Lucid dreaming?
Andy: Yeah, where you're still kind of awake and have these wild thoughts.
Daryl: Your mind is so open, yeah.
Andy: What he would do is, he'd hold a bell, and then right when he got there, the bell would drop, and it would wake him up and he'd remember all that and write it down.
Manson: Oh, that's good.
Andy: And I've done that.
Jon: I would go the other way.
Manson: I keep a notebook by my bed.
Jon: Yeah. When I have writer's block, that's the best way for me to get over it - is as soon as you wake up in the morning, and you're sort of not all there yet - you just get on the computer and start to write.
Jon: And the first page is crap, but it gets you, you know - you get some momentum going.
Manson: I write - I have very bizarre dreams. I write 'em down a lot. But I drink absinthe a lot. And before I go to bed, and that's very...
Andy: You do? No, you don't drink the real thing. You can't get it here.
Jon: It's the new absinthe.
Daryl: You CAN get it here.
Manson: I don't get it here.
Andy: You can't get the real one.
Daryl: You CAN get the real one.
Manson: I don't get it here!
Andy: The real one is aged with wormwood and it has, like, a hallucinogenic...
Manson: Do you wanna listen to me? Do you wanna behave?
Andy: Go ahead.
Manson: I don't get it here. And I have a wormwood plant, so I have real absinthe, and I have wormwood. And it's not as...
Manson: ... dangerous as the old absinthe because the old absinthe was just distilled improperly. But no, it's very inspiring though, as far as like - it does make you - it's not like just getting drunk.
Daryl: It's hallucinatory.
Andy: There's a book out that I just bought, I'm not kidding about this. It's called Writing on Drugs. And it's about getting high and then writing. I was fascinated by that.
Manson: There's another...
Andy: Everybody's writing starts out real fun, from what I've been reading in this book. And there's some brilliant writers who did absinthe and hardcore, like - like shooting up and heroin and opium, and all this stuff.
Andy: And all their writing starts out almost brilliant, and sometimes they're - they become brilliant, very, very famous writers, but then their writing slowly becomes about...
Manson: They go crazy.
Andy: ... how crazy they're going.
Andy: And they finally become obscure, and people don't like the writing at all.
Manson: That's where I'm at right about now.
Andy: And then they drop off and mostly die. (to Manson) That's where you're at?! (claps and laughs)
[END CREDITS ROLL... but the conversation continues]
Daryl: I assumed that this show was something about independent film-making, and it's not. I keep trying to draw the subject matter back to independent film (laughs).
Andy: He's trying - he's trying his fucking damnedest to make it about independent films. But then, you know, you get interesting people together, we're gonna talk about - well, I'd like to talk about sex.
- Andy Dick played a parody of Manson on MTV's The Andy Dick Show.
- The film The Criminal Life of Archibaldo de la Cruz by Luis Buñuel, focuses on a would-be serial killer whose plans, although elaborate, never result in an actual murder.
- In the lyrics for Unkillable Monster Manson alludes to Luis Buñuel's film El Ángel Exterminador (The Exterminating Angel)
Transcription thanks to Unpretty Unsafe